Sight glass position

[Lopez Mike]

I can and do appreciate high tech stuff but the greenhorns I have to educate are convinced that things like critical point steam and a turbine will shock and amaze all of us. True but not in the was they have in mind!

Fortunately they are always the types that confine their delusions to posting and never waste too much money and time cutting steel. But I do feel bad for them and most always just guide them with facts and the hard won experience of generations.

[fredrosse]

"There seems to be a common misconception occasionally when people become interested in steam that there are lots of stones to still overturn and with what we have nowadays, we can do much better. ................ They eventually realize that even with modern materials, design programs and microprocessors, no real gains are to be had. "

While that statement is generally true, there have been significant advances in steam engine performance in recent times. The basic problem however, is that even with the available technical advances, the small steam plant will continue to be somewhat less efficient than the Internal Combustion Engines which are so well developed and readily available. That virtually removes any incentive for the capitalists to further fund developments here, and just a handful of small steam power enthusiasts (we steamboaters, steam car people, etc.) can do very little to advance the steam engine technology.

A good example is the Whitecliffs Solar Power Project, they had a 25 KW reciprocating steam plant, where the steam was generated with focusing solar collectors, and this small plant had an efficiency of about 22% (conversion of boiler heat output to mechanical power), far better than the large triple expansion marine steam plants from 1900 - 1940 era, managing only about 13% efficiency, even though these large plants had a large advantage of scale, being from 2000 to 10,000 horsepower.

[DetroiTug]

That would be great if someone were to come up with a small steam plant that rivaled the Deezel in efficiency. I'd own one somehow. Driving a steam car or boat is unlike any sort of internal combustion engine. The power is immense (with sufficient steam pressure) and very smooth. As Jay Leno says "it's like the hand of God". An electric motor, rotary or linear like that of a roller coaster is probably the closest thing to it.

I think the problem is not in the mechanical design of the engine nor the boiler, but in the heat - where it all starts. For small scale steam to ever have a chance to make it's way back to mainstream, we need to learn how to make/extract inexpensive heat, or find a natural source of heat ( as mentioned, solar is one), and come up with better ways to handle/transfer the heat. Tall order and I have no idea what that would be. Just about any fuel one can come up with, anything that can be vaporized or gasified (wood) can be ran in an I/C engine.

Simply making a big fire with fossil fuels, heating a medium, then transferring it all for work somewhere else with all of the accompanying thermal losses - while the I/C engine does all of this in a small chamber with very little loss - so well that the thermal levels need to radiated to a cooling system. That is a tough act to follow.

This may read like I am debasing steam in general, I'm not. Simply addressing the folly of newcomers with wild ideas about building a steam this or that and changing the way we live. As some contemporary concerns have claimed.

There have been some pretty well funded efforts as of late to build a competitive modern small scale steam plant and to date, none of them have been successful. Each of those with varying definitions in their mission statement One here in the US over the last 10 years has went through many millions of dollars from what I've read and nothing to really show for it, and there were some very competent folks contributing at different times. Several lucrative federal Green initiative grants to others. So far - nada.

-Ron

Sorry Pat, we took this baby way off the rails.

[mtnman]

Way off the rails but ever so interesting just the same!

[Lopez Mike]

Yes, this has been an epic thread hijack. But a good one.

For me, steam boating is its own reward. Moving almost silently at hull speed or below.

Where I live, San Juan County in Washington State, we have banned personal water craft. The silence has been deafening.

Looking forwards to a season of contemplating my sight glass.